Varnage Release

[Hellzone]

i read the messagge, and i understand that pretty much say that the char
it's bad because i take like base the arachnoman venom, hum when other creator do this method and release 1 NEW char( if it's bad ok it's bad, BUT BECAUSE I DON'T LIKE THE CHAR ,NO BECAUSE THE CREATOR USE THIS METHOD i don't care what method the creator use for make new char, when 1 char it's release it's always 1 great think after if the char it's bad i don't take the char, if it's good i take the char,( this is my opinion) so if 4-5 person don't like this char ok no problem i respect all the opinion,  in all the forum this char was a success so a'm happy for this,and i don't think in the future i found 1 coder can help me for replace the part about the ai and the combo, if i found ok, if i don't found the life goes on,the char it's perfectly playable this is the important think

for the next char( if i try at make 1 other char) if i have the the coder partner ok, but if i don't have the coder partner i use always this method

Its not bad for your first character broski.

[JARRO77]

yes i know the char it's not bad because it was a success in all the forum and to all the people like it, but, for someone the problem it's i take the base from venom arachnoman which has a strong Ai and combo, but i explain because a'm not a coder, and i think this is a good alternative for make char

[Darkflare]

Its not bad for your first character broski.

I'm afraid the evidence presented contradicts this statement.

i read the messagge, and i understand that pretty much say that the char
it's bad because i take like base the arachnoman venom, hum when other creator do this method and release 1 NEW char( if it's bad ok it's bad, BUT BECAUSE I DON'T LIKE THE CHAR ,NO BECAUSE THE CREATOR USE THIS METHOD i don't care what method the creator use for make new char, when 1 char it's release it's always 1 great think after if the char it's bad i don't take the char, if it's good i take the char,( this is my opinion) so if 4-5 person don't like this char ok no problem i respect all the opinion,  in all the forum this char was a success so a'm happy for this,and i don't think in the future i found 1 coder can help me for replace the part about the ai and the combo, if i found ok, if i don't found the life goes on,the char it's perfectly playable this is the important think

for the next char( if i try at make 1 other char) if i have the the coder partner ok, but if i don't have the coder partner i use always this method

All right, it's hard for me to decipher this, because your english is astrocious (Yes, I'm aware that you're italian and it's not your primary language)

It's bad because the base you took was horrible to begin with.
Yes, certain other creators have taken other creations and editted them as well(Myself included), but they actually took the time to make proper edits (i.e, not making holy god orochi evil versions of them)

Once again, the don't dl if you don't like it argument is flawed because...well....how else am I going to know if I like something if I don't try it?

This character needs a serious overhaul to even be considered decent. Yes, it need THAT much work. His standing stance doesn't even loop properly, how did you even miss this?



As for the rest of you, I'm aware you guys want to encourage creators with their work, but giving nothing but praise and never pointing out the problems solves nothing and only works on making the problem even worse in the long run.

[JARRO77]

i think each person have their own opinion about things, and this is your opinion,for me the char it's good and for now i don't want update, because when 1 new char enter  in the game of mugen, if this char like a
(example 100 persons) and 3-4 people do not like for some reason, ok it's Normal, because One particular thing can not like at all ( Exept for the p****) , but if in future i decide to update varnage,going to take into consideration all this stuff you said and try to fix

[Darkflare]

You don't want to update?
So basically, you never intended to bother fixing any of your mistakes and making sure things worked properly. You just released it for the sake of releasing it and who cares how good or bad it is.


Fine, but don't expect people to take you seriously the next time.

[Rage]

can we move on. we all know the issues by now. Its a decent start. A decent character period. there are many that don't even make to this stage. I personally don't care for it because of the cosmetics. Thats my opinion. The same as saying Kongs characters are crap. To my knowledge. His characters where made to just bring said characters into mugen. So there is no certain way they should play. People just want to base it off of mvc mechanics because he use those games resources. I know people that consider Kong stuff a god send. I conciser it good because He put allot out there when there wasn't much. Its a starting place. the beginning. Rome wasn't built in a day. If the author never stated said character plays like such they didn't fail/ fall short in creating. It can be viewed as type of copy out but its sound. Things like this gives us a base to better our self in the future.  I personally thought my first character was the stuff and nothing was wrong with him but as time went on and i learned more i realized i fell short in doing what I envisioned. So in time i seek to improve my work by just starting over and not fixing the past. Nothing is wrong with that.

If hes happy with the way the character plays then that's what he wants. If it not to your liking find something else. once you bring concerns to his attention and he says i hear you but i want it like this move on.

[JARRO77]

Thanks Rage for the king words ,you'r right

for Darkflare man i understand what you say, but i think( NOW I'm seriously considering in your brain there is something wrong I've already explained how I feel, ( THIS IS DIFFERENCES OF OPINION, i like this char and most of people likes it
you don't like this char and it's ok, don't use this char


i think this guy Darkflare has something against me, hum when i listen 1 song, when i play with some char, when i see some movie, or other stuff
( if this Particular think i don't like, a'm not going by the person who made and start at break his c**k for smal stuff, i symply don't use that thing IT'S EASY, i understand what you think, and i told you, if i decide to update in future i try to fix what you say, remember  you must always respect the work of the people if you like the work good, if you don't like nothing

[Rage]

Thanks Rage for the king words ,you'r right

for Darkflare man i understand what you say, but i think( NOW I'm seriously considering in your brain there is something wrong I've already explained how I feel, ( THIS IS DIFFERENCES OF OPINION, i like this char and most of people likes it
you don't like this char and it's ok, don't use this char


i think this guy Darkflare has something against me, hum when i listen 1 song, when i play with some char, when i see some movie, or other stuff
( if this Particular think i don't like, a'm not going by the person who made and start at break his c**k for smal stuff, i symply don't use that thing IT'S EASY, i understand what you think, and i told you, if i decide to update in future i try to fix what you say, remember  you must always respect the work of the people if you like the work good, if you don't like nothing

LOOK IM GETTING TIRED OF THIS NOW! it takes two people to argue. comments like what i bolded above just egg people on. Just dont say anything. If you want to talk it out with him/ her fine do it via pm. Just dont  insult each other. If you dont care dont say anything to said person let it be there problem. If things get bad you have us the mediator to mediate the situation.

Now lets chill and get back to gaming and creating. 

[Darkflare]

can we move on. we all know the issues by now. Its a decent start. A decent character period. there are many that don't even make to this stage. I personally don't care for it because of the cosmetics. Thats my opinion. The same as saying Kongs characters are crap. To my knowledge. His characters where made to just bring said characters into mugen. So there is no certain way they should play. People just want to base it off of mvc mechanics because he use those games resources. I know people that consider Kong stuff a god send. I conciser it good because He put allot out there when there wasn't much. Its a starting place. the beginning. Rome wasn't built in a day. If the author never stated said character plays like such they didn't fail/ fall short in creating. It can be viewed as type of copy out but its sound. Things like this gives us a base to better our self in the future.  I personally thought my first character was the stuff and nothing was wrong with him but as time went on and i learned more i realized i fell short in doing what I envisioned. So in time i seek to improve my work by just starting over and not fixing the past. Nothing is wrong with that.

If hes happy with the way the character plays then that's what he wants. If it not to your liking find something else. once you bring concerns to his attention and he says i hear you but i want it like this move on.

So you're basically saying that you're willing to accept mediocrity just because you believe it could be a base for something.

This is a decent start? A decent character? My video alone proved how horribly flawed the character is. Even the basics are done wrong in this character.

Kong made those characters just to bring them to Mugen? Maybe it was better off to NOT bring them at all and wait for someone else that was willing to do the job RIGHT to bring them themselves. Seriously, every time I look at a Kong character I always have to ask what the hell he was thinking.

A terrible base will lead to a terrible result. This thing isn't even worth using as a base. It needs to be scrapped and redone again this time looking at properly made characters to use as a base for the work instead of some lopsided "creation" from someone that didn't even care about putting effort.


If you want good results, you gotta put effort into it. Like life, there are no shortcuts in Mugen.

for Darkflare man i understand what you say, but i think( NOW I'm seriously considering in your brain there is something wrong I've already explained how I feel, ( THIS IS DIFFERENCES OF OPINION, i like this char and most of people likes it
you don't like this char and it's ok, don't use this char

I really don't think you understand, but whatever.

i think this guy Darkflare has something against me, hum when i listen 1 song, when i play with some char, when i see some movie, or other stuff
( if this Particular think i don't like, a'm not going by the person who made and start at break his c**k for smal stuff, i symply don't use that thing IT'S EASY, i understand what you think, and i told you, if i decide to update in future i try to fix what you say, remember  you must always respect the work of the people if you like the work good, if you don't like nothing

Yea, I have it against you, just like I have it against everyone else I have criticized their work on. 

You're telling me to respect your work, but it doesn't seem like you respect it yourself enough to even bother to keep working on it.



Looks like I'll be done here. I think I've shown just where this thing  is headed to.

[JARRO77]

Did you hear what he says Rage?? if i want i can answer you but i don't want talk forever with you ,i undertsand what you say and it's only your opinion so stop now

[Rage]

Im trying to be cool here please drop it.

This is mugen. WE CREATE WHAT WE WANT. THERE ARE NO RULES UNTIL YOU APPLY THEM ETHER A SAID GAMES MECHANICS OR YOUR OWN PERSONAL. Your missing the point of what makes this engine so great.


I wont ask yall to chill again.

[C.M.G]

Im trying to be cool here please drop it.

This is mugen. WE CREATE WHAT WE WANT. THERE ARE NO RULES UNTIL YOU APPLY THEM ETHER A SAID GAMES MECHANICS OR YOUR OWN PERSONAL. Your missing the point of what makes this engine so great.


I wont ask yall to chill again.

Ya, got a point their rage. Won't argue with that. 

[C.R.O.M. - 有且只有一個]

Listen to the Princess she knows what she's talking about, anyways Jarr I love the character however the AI should be toned down a little bit and I only mean a little bit, and some sound on the win pose and possibly the portrait needs fixed other than that I think its great for a first release like Rage said some people do not make it this far.

[Rage]

Listen to the Princess she knows what she's talking about, anyways Jarr I love the character however the AI should be toned down a little bit and I only mean a little bit, and some sound on the win pose and possibly the portrait needs fixed other than that I think its great for a first release like Rage said some people do not make it this far.

Rage is Rage need i say more

[JARRO77]

Thanks man , for the sound of win pose i don't add the sound because, at the end of the char i do the win pose and that day i had a problem with the speakers of my pc, so i could not edit the sound and i decide do not add the sound in the win pose, in future if i decide for do 1 update of course i add the sound it's easy , for the portrait, it's by Wilian i don't know resize the portrait, about the AI a'm not a coder, i dont know if i can decrease the value of Ai , thanks Man for the feedback

[O Ilusionista]

Rage, even I do not agree with the way Darkflare say the things sometimes, he is right and have valid points. Those points REALLY needs to be fixed, just take a look at the video:


Just in preview, you can already see that the blue clsn (the blue boxes) are wrong. We can't just use the "if you don't like, don't download it" phrase because it sounds like an excuse, a excuse that was used a lot here in IMT in the past, but people finally understand that this isn't the way things works.

JARRO77, I want to help you (in fact, Darkflare was trying to help you too), so let me point you somethings, using the video as a guide, ok?

-0:00 - Look at blue boxes in Varnage body. There are too much boxes (this consumes more moemory) and there is a lot of "holes" between those boxes, something that is wrong. The original creator had used an old version of Fighter Factory which has a Automatic CLSN maker, which was intended to be used in projectiles, but people started to use this on the whole chars, so I requested to remove it.

Another exemple in his walk


-0:35 - Varnage goes through the enemy, missing it even if he is close to the enemy.

Those moves makes the hitsparks (the flashes when the move hits) appears on the wrong place, plus they doesn't uses the chars hitsparks


There are more things to fix.

THINGS TO HELP YOU:
Just look at the CLSN of the other char, its just ONE box. That doesn't fits Varnage, but just look how simple it its. There is a great tutorial about boxes here, please read it : http://kod.trinitymugen.net/K.O.D's_Basic_CLSN_Tutorial.html

Here you can see a whole char tutorial in many videos, I know this will helps you a lot too http://www.infinitymugenteam.com/Forum_345/index.php?topic=39096.0

I really liked those moves, they are nice ideas


I hope this helps you.

See ya

[C.M.G]

Rage, even I do not agree with the way Darkflare say the things sometimes, he is right and have valid points. Those points REALLY needs to be fixed, just take a look at the video:


Just in preview, you can already see that the blue clsn (the blue boxes) are wrong. We can't just use the "if you don't like, don't download it" phrase because it sounds like an excuse, a excuse that was used a lot here in IMT in the past, but people finally understand that this isn't the way things works.

JARRO77, I want to help you (in fact, Darkflare was trying to help you too), so let me point you somethings, using the video as a guide, ok?

-0:00 - Look at blue boxes in Varnage body. There are too much boxes (this consumes more moemory) and there is a lot of "holes" between those boxes, something that is wrong. The original creator had used an old version of Fighter Factory which has a Automatic CLSN maker, which was intended to be used in projectiles, but people started to use this on the whole chars, so I requested to remove it.

Another exemple in his walk


-0:35 - Varnage goes through the enemy, missing it even if he is close to the enemy.

Those moves makes the hitsparks (the flashes when the move hits) appears on the wrong place, plus they doesn't uses the chars hitsparks


There are more things to fix.

THINGS TO HELP YOU:
Just look at the CLSN of the other char, its just ONE box. That doesn't fits Varnage, but just look how simple it its. There is a great tutorial about boxes here, please read it : http://kod.trinitymugen.net/K.O.D's_Basic_CLSN_Tutorial.html

Here you can see a whole char tutorial in many videos, I know this will helps you a lot too http://www.infinitymugenteam.com/Forum_345/index.php?topic=39096.0

I really liked those moves, they are nice ideas


I hope this helps you.

See ya

Wow Jarro77 you just got a help from the MUGEN veteran.  Please listen to the master as he teaches you the way. 

[Rage]

Rage, even I do not agree with the way Darkflare say the things sometimes, he is right and have valid points. Those points REALLY needs to be fixed, just take a look at the video:

Lets agree to disagree. I stand by there is no rules in mugen.  I seen the video and the character dont meet my standards or yall ether but this aint a business. Nothing NEEDS to be fixed. however it is a decent start. Also he never mentioned a certain play style so...yeah it is what it is. You should have a direction you want to take your work but you can make it just to make it We as a community have certain standards but they are not rules, they are not concrete. So if some operates out side the norm we dont burn him.  so if he dont want to be like us let him.


 I never said anything about the info Darkflare was giving rather it be good or bad. What is bad is making your points and then keep harping on them when one choose to by pass them. my point is that  JARRO77 wasn't interested. if that's the case then there aint nothing to you, me, anyone can do. Now if im to comment on the feed he gave. Minus his tone it was DAME good. I wish someone would do that for me. not to many people go that far.

Sorry if it looked like i was taking Jarro's side. I wasnt, everyone knows i got crazy high standards. I also operate out side the norm too tho.

[JARRO77]

Thanks O for your help with the video and the rest now i try at fix somethink

[Macaulyn97]

I think Rage is giving too much protection to JARRO77. There are no rules in MUGEN indeed (because if there were, we wouldn't have characters such as God-Hyper-Super-Hell-Shadow Orochi), but if you're going to make a character that doesn't have a good gameplay and release it, you better be prepared to listen to others' opinion, specially because you can use it to update your character to a better one. Darkflare is not trying to offend you, we said why the character is not good and said why, but it seems that you are too selfish to listen to people unless they're praising you.

[JARRO77]

lolll, i always accept the feedback and the advice i already fix 3 error, said o, but I think there are different ways of saying things,and for what I think Darkflares has used the offensive words can say that just because you are behind a pc, varnage does not have a bad gameplay, at least you tried varnage???.....

[Macaulyn97]

lolll, i always accept the feedback and the advice i already fix 3 error, said o, but I think there are different ways of saying things,and for what I think Darkflares has used the offensive words can say that just because you are behind a pc, varnage does not have a bad gameplay, at least you tried varnage???.....

I did, and when I saw that you used Kong/Arachnoman's Venom as a base, I saw that it was a bad character. I would try at least to change the base, make the character again, this time, use XCB's Venom, you'll see that it will get better comments.

[Darkflare]

however the AI should be toned down a little bit and I only mean a little bit,

I don't know if you noticed, but the AI cheats. It breaks out of things it's not supposed to break out of just to throw a super at you. It also completely bypasses the cooldown of his moves for the sake of keeping himself unfairly safe. This is partly due to the way Kong "made" his AIs since you can find the same cheating AI in any of Kong's characters.

and for what I think Darkflares has used the offensive words can say that

When did I use offensive words?
That was you on the comments on my video.

[JARRO77]

ok i undestand MacaulynGameLover


for Darkflare i don't like your reasoning, you can't post video in youtube against one char, only because you don't like the char, this is incorrect shame, shame, Shame, so i don't want start other drama, in this forum or in youtube,i think me and you we will never reach a compromise because you have your opinion and i have my opinion so,realy man stop, i don't like solve the problem with the pc, because does not make sense, you were wrong to put that video because you want to see only the bad about the char, and it's incorrect

[Darkflare]

Have you ever heard the saying "A picture is worth a thousand words"?

Well, a video is worth a thousand pictures, maybe even more.

In other words...

I can.
And I wlll.