Post by: JARRO77 on April 12, 2013, 02:30:41 PM
Thanks supaman2525 for the help in the stand strong punch anche some fix in the stand
Thanks Ryon for the code of the hyper move Symbiote war Bomb
Thanks wil.li.an for the Portrait
I don't asked the permission for use the Venom by Kong, because i thouth at the end this char was very different but your' right, i credit Arachnoman too for me having used venom
Thanks theFuTur3 for the permission for use some sprite of carnage
Thanks Heka for some advice and fix about the color
Thanks empawk for the Hyper port
in this video you can see the watch mode, and after in the training the other moves of varnage,the video it's a litle fast because i use this program for the first time and i wrong somethink but aniway in the game varnage work fine
Varnage Mugen Release (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8N7qUzHTla8#)
i add some original moves in this char and i think the result it's good, I hope that everyone will like this char, this is my version of varnage, a'm happy for the first release and i can't wait for do 1 other char heheeh
Link for the char : http://www.mediafire.com/?h1m763bgwxyn21q (http://www.mediafire.com/?h1m763bgwxyn21q)
Varnage but with the stand strong punch no long reach
http://www.mediafire.com/?9il1ck99lzv461c (http://www.mediafire.com/?9il1ck99lzv461c)
Post by: Beto on April 12, 2013, 05:03:34 PM
Post by: O Ilusionista on April 12, 2013, 05:09:54 PM
Post by: C.R.O.M. - 有且只有一個 on April 12, 2013, 06:50:51 PM
Post by: O Ilusionista on April 12, 2013, 09:00:10 PM
Post by: C.R.O.M. - 有且只有一個 on April 12, 2013, 10:38:14 PM
Post by: Hellzone on April 12, 2013, 10:41:43 PM
Post by: C.R.O.M. - 有且只有一個 on April 12, 2013, 11:11:35 PM
Post by: Hellzone on April 12, 2013, 11:15:41 PM
Post by: C.R.O.M. - 有且只有一個 on April 13, 2013, 12:06:42 AM
Post by: Macaulyn97 on April 13, 2013, 12:09:03 AM
Post by: Hellzone on April 13, 2013, 12:19:18 AM
Post by: JARRO77 on April 13, 2013, 01:11:08 AM
Post by: JARRO77 on April 13, 2013, 01:42:17 AM
http://www.mediafire.com/?9il1ck99lzv461c (http://www.mediafire.com/?9il1ck99lzv461c)
Post by: Macaulyn97 on April 13, 2013, 01:44:40 AM
i take like base this venom because have [...] a Very good gameplay*Iceman ThumbsDown!* You've got to be kidding me.
Post by: JARRO77 on April 13, 2013, 01:50:31 AM
Post by: catbat74 on April 13, 2013, 03:43:08 AM
No it works for 1.0 and nothing oldernope, it works on my winmugen dc vs marvel screenpack just fine, i'll post a vid in the near future to prove it
Post by: Darkflare on April 13, 2013, 05:18:09 AM
i take like base this venom because have 1 great AI and a Very good gameplay,
Kong's characters having good gameplay?
Have you even played Marvel vs Capcom at all?
Kong's characters are astrocious. I don't even need to explain why
But just in case... (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ykTPLfyt2M#)
Yes, it still applies after 4 years.
i think this marvel vs capcom venom have 1 good AI and it's more strongher, and it's easy to use, the combo are good, and the char it's more fluid, ( this is my opinion),
If your criteria for a good character is a strong AI, you really should reconsider your criteria.
Post by: JARRO77 on April 13, 2013, 05:24:11 AM
Kong's characters having good gameplay?
Have you even played Marvel vs Capcom at all?
Kong's characters are astrocious. I don't even need to explain why
But just in case... (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ykTPLfyt2M#)
Yes, it still applies after 4 years.
If your criteria for a good character is a strong AI, you really should reconsider your criteria.
and, my criteria it's not like yuo say man,i don't need to explay you my criteria, i just want make char, but at the end the think it's easy if you like this char download if you don't like, don't download it's easy
Post by: Darkflare on April 13, 2013, 05:32:05 AM
and, my criteria it's not like yuo say man,i don't need to explay you my criteria, i just want make char,
So you're just making characters for the sake of making characters and not even going to bother to put any effort into them?
but at the end the think it's easy if you like this char download if you don't like, don't download it's easy
This line is a horrible way to cop out of getting criticism.
So I'll just tell you straight right now before you decide to go further.
If you're going to make a character and release it publicly, you better be prepared to take on all forms of criticism regarding your work. Good AND bad. They're going to come whether you like it or not.
Post by: JARRO77 on April 13, 2013, 05:48:50 AM
Post by: Angelus_Silverhead on April 13, 2013, 05:54:21 AM
As for me, Varnage have too much strong AI. It is very-very-very hard to beat him.
Post by: Hellzone on April 13, 2013, 05:59:37 AM
Post by: Beto on April 13, 2013, 08:25:13 AM
Post by: supa2520 on April 13, 2013, 09:52:52 AM
at lease give JARRO77 some props :cool
Post by: Macaulyn97 on April 13, 2013, 11:06:06 AM
yea i know , i respect your opinion, but, Not to say that there is no work behind this character, i only take the part about the code Ai and gameplay because a'm not a coder,and no one wanted to help for finish the char, so for this i can't make char?? o realy?? , I have not destroyed or damaged other character,and are not the first that uses this method to make the characters, i think this char it's good,the sprites are my, the code for the new moves are my,almost all sound too, and other stuff too, i respect your opinion but when i see 1 char i do not like a'm not going to despise or insult the creator or the char symply i don't download the char, and i use this methof for the life in everythink you should never despise the work of others good or bad, for the nex time, if i have 1 partner coder good, but if i don't have a partner coder, i use the same this methodIf you didn't get a code partner (and didn't want to learn coding), why didn't you simply used a good Venom?
Post by: JARRO77 on April 13, 2013, 12:06:38 PM
If you didn't get a code partner (and didn't want to learn coding), why didn't you simply used a good Venom?
man but venom by arachnoman it's a good venom
Post by: Darkflare on April 13, 2013, 03:11:16 PM
yea i know , i respect your opinion, but, Not to say that there is no work behind this character, i only take the part about the code Ai and gameplay because a'm not a coder,and no one wanted to help for finish the char, so for this i can't make char?? o realy??
Did you even ask for help for this?
but when i see 1 char i do not like a'm not going to despise or insult the creator or the char symply i don't download the char, and i use this methof for the life in everythink you should never despise the work of others good or bad, for the nex time, if i have 1 partner coder good, but if i don't have a partner coder, i use the same this method
If we used this method of ignorance in life, we might as well accept mediocrity for everything since we're not willing to criticize anything so it can be improved.
Besides, how am I going to tell if something is good or bad if I don't try it?
Oh, c-mon, man. It is his first character and he is not a coder.
I would rather not let him give a free pass just cause it's his first. Plenty of creators have done excellent work as their first character so it's really a poor excuse to be excempted from criticism.
man but venom by arachnoman it's a good venom
XCB's/Big Eli King's Venom is better
Post by: Macaulyn97 on April 13, 2013, 03:22:34 PM
thanks guys for the answer i really appreciate it :)!a'm happy that you enjoyed,No he isn't, he is the worst actually (and arachnoman is probably a poor edit of Kong's Venom, and all of Kong's characters are bad), anyway, you could optate to use XCB's Venom, he was the best one
man but venom by arachnoman it's a good venom
Post by: Macaulyn97 on April 13, 2013, 03:25:13 PM
Oh, c-mon, man. It is his first character and he is not a coder.Many non-coder creations are good, take Duracelleur's edits for example.
As for me, Varnage have too much strong AI. It is very-very-very hard to beat him.
Anyway, its not the AI, Kong's characters (even though this one was edited somewhere by Arachnoman) can chain through almost all attacks, this make their combos very long.
Post by: dan_aracena on April 13, 2013, 03:36:16 PM
Read the releases of more experimented creators like Acey, Loganir or Zvitor ... they also make critics, but with solutions, talking about details, how to improve them or making sugestions ....
Dont take me wrong, but underestimate the criteria or likes of a creator (using the base he wants) and make fun of it with sarcasm, thats not a sugestion or improve IT ALL !!! ... Critics are very diffrent from sarcasm ... I can make a critic to my boss in my job, but if i make it with sarcasm, i'll be fired the next day .... And if i make a critic to one of my people, they have to improve what i pointed wrong, but if i use sarcasm or make fun of them at any level, they will go to the Human Resuorces department, i will get a punish for it .......
I talk you about this because its true that we have critics of any thing we create, at any level ... But the people that doesnt make constructive critics, doesnt get anywhere ...
I hope you dont take this wrong, but this dude created something and its his first creation, he needs encourage advices, instead of sarcastic comments ....
Post by: Angelus_Silverhead on April 13, 2013, 03:42:41 PM
Many non-coder creations are good, take Duracelleur's edits for example.
Anyway, its not the AI, Kong's characters (even though this one was edited somewhere by Arachnoman) can chain through almost all attacks, this make their combos very long.
As for me, character is good. But yes, his AI is really too much strong. However I like specials and creative ideas in this character.
Post by: O Ilusionista on April 13, 2013, 04:19:50 PM
My only concern was about the lack of credits, I haven't tested the char per se. If he already put the credits, that is ok to me.
we do not need sarcasm on the feedback, we don't think this is funny here, instead of some other foruns. People here try to help each others. Just give your feedback, pointing what is wrong, and maybe how he can fix it. Sarcasm just ruim everything, its like a kid joke: just kids thinks its funny.
Things like
Quote
It looks pretty good, but the fact that it used Kong's character as a based screwed it.
Wont help him. At all. I've watched some Kong's chars turned into something really cool, so its not a rule set in the stone.
Besides I think Darkflare is hitting too hard, I have to agree with this:
Quote
but at the end the think it's easy if you like this char download if you don't like, don't download it's easy
Quote
This line is a horrible way to cop out of getting criticism.
Indeed its a horrible way to handle criticism. JARRO77 You should just try to learn from a criticism, even if its a hard one, and improve your char.
Well, after everything been said, how about start to give some real feedbacK? :P
Post by: Beto on April 13, 2013, 04:27:01 PM
Post by: Darkflare on April 13, 2013, 04:36:01 PM
I'm going to see if I can force myself to give a deeper test of this.
Post by: Darkflare on April 13, 2013, 06:17:28 PM
Post by: Macaulyn97 on April 13, 2013, 06:56:00 PM
Post by: C.R.O.M. - 有且只有一個 on April 13, 2013, 07:12:44 PM
Sarcasm? I don't recall using that, I was very clear and I'll say that again: the char was bad because of the use of Kong/Arachnoman's character as a base. Another Venom, like XCB's should have been used. I also said that Kong's character is bad not much because of his AI difficulty, is mostly because the AI is coded to chain through almost all attacks, making exaggeratedly long combos. I think I can't be more clear than that.
Look at Loganir's Sandman or CC's Clayface. Those AIs do the very same things but they are great characters.
Post by: Darkflare on April 13, 2013, 07:47:41 PM
Look at Loganir's Sandman or CC's Clayface. Those AIs do the very same things but they are great characters.
Those two actually have reaqsonable chaining in their AIs.
The ones in Kong's characters make up their rules as they please.
How bad is it? Kong's characters in their "hard" AIs can beat Rare Akuma.
Post by: C.R.O.M. - 有且只有一個 on April 13, 2013, 08:19:26 PM
Post by: Macaulyn97 on April 13, 2013, 08:20:09 PM
Look at Loganir's Sandman or CC's Clayface. Those AIs do the very same things but they are great characters.No, they don't. They can chain into stronger attacks, or from kicks to punches,or from normals to specials like normal characters would do. Kong's characters make insanely long combos by pressing one or two buttons. And indeed, Sandman and Clayface are great characters, Kong's creations are not.
Post by: Macaulyn97 on April 13, 2013, 08:21:38 PM
Well to be fair given the right character anyone can beat Rare Akuma lolWe're talking about AI's, not playable. If we were speaking about gameplay, any character could beat any character (that isn't cheap) if he/she had pratice enough.
Post by: C.R.O.M. - 有且只有一個 on April 13, 2013, 08:23:00 PM
Now onto some feedback:
Not sure if this is intentional but his winpose has no sound.
The portrait while Awesome should be resized to something a little smaller.
Ill update this with more as I test him.
Post by: Darkflare on April 13, 2013, 08:45:57 PM
Well to be fair given the right character anyone can beat Rare Akuma lol
Rare Akuma was intended to be a incredibly cheap character as a parody of the broken characters out there.
If it can beat Rare Akuma, then I would worry about some serious balance and gameplay issues rather than brush it off as "lol any cheap character can beat Rare Akuma".
Post by: Macaulyn97 on April 13, 2013, 08:52:10 PM
If it can beat Rare Akuma, then I would worry about some serious balance and gameplay issues rather than brush it off as "lol any cheap character can beat Rare Akuma".I second that, I hope this Varnage gets a huge update, otherwise, it will not be a good character.
Post by: C.R.O.M. - 有且只有一個 on April 13, 2013, 08:57:54 PM
Post by: Darkflare on April 13, 2013, 09:03:42 PM
Except you're supposed to change the cmd file for the hard one in the def file and not the in-mugen AI difficulty level.
Post by: C.M.G on April 13, 2013, 11:08:48 PM
.........maybe in the future you'll get to that character coding someday.
Post by: Macaulyn97 on April 14, 2013, 12:04:41 AM
Varnage needs overhaul. The bases should be varied and need to decide according to the desired movesets of the character. I don't need to DL this character but JARRO77 you should accept what they say because its true and I should guess you're knew to MUGEN Forums. They're not bashing you but they're through your base of your character. Having a bad char doesn't mean you're a bad person. Cheer up man!^^(PM)^ ^^(PM)^ ^^(PM)^ ^^(PM)^ ^^(PM)^ ^^(PM)^ ^^(PM)^
.........maybe in the future you'll get to that character coding someday.
Post by: JARRO77 on April 14, 2013, 01:50:31 AM
it's bad because i take like base the arachnoman venom, hum when other creator do this method and release 1 NEW char( if it's bad ok it's bad, BUT BECAUSE I DON'T LIKE THE CHAR ,NO BECAUSE THE CREATOR USE THIS METHOD i don't care what method the creator use for make new char, when 1 char it's release it's always 1 great think after if the char it's bad i don't take the char, if it's good i take the char,( this is my opinion) so if 4-5 person don't like this char ok no problem i respect all the opinion, in all the forum this char was a success so a'm happy for this,and i don't think in the future i found 1 coder can help me for replace the part about the ai and the combo, if i found ok, if i don't found the life goes on,the char it's perfectly playable this is the important think
for the next char( if i try at make 1 other char) if i have the the coder partner ok, but if i don't have the coder partner i use always this method
Post by: Hellzone on April 14, 2013, 01:55:13 AM
i read the messagge, and i understand that pretty much say that the char
it's bad because i take like base the arachnoman venom, hum when other creator do this method and release 1 NEW char( if it's bad ok it's bad, BUT BECAUSE I DON'T LIKE THE CHAR ,NO BECAUSE THE CREATOR USE THIS METHOD i don't care what method the creator use for make new char, when 1 char it's release it's always 1 great think after if the char it's bad i don't take the char, if it's good i take the char,( this is my opinion) so if 4-5 person don't like this char ok no problem i respect all the opinion, in all the forum this char was a success so a'm happy for this,and i don't think in the future i found 1 coder can help me for replace the part about the ai and the combo, if i found ok, if i don't found the life goes on,the char it's perfectly playable this is the important think
for the next char( if i try at make 1 other char) if i have the the coder partner ok, but if i don't have the coder partner i use always this method
Its not bad for your first character broski.
Post by: JARRO77 on April 14, 2013, 02:08:45 AM
Post by: Darkflare on April 14, 2013, 03:36:50 AM
Its not bad for your first character broski.
I'm afraid the evidence presented contradicts this statement.
i read the messagge, and i understand that pretty much say that the char
it's bad because i take like base the arachnoman venom, hum when other creator do this method and release 1 NEW char( if it's bad ok it's bad, BUT BECAUSE I DON'T LIKE THE CHAR ,NO BECAUSE THE CREATOR USE THIS METHOD i don't care what method the creator use for make new char, when 1 char it's release it's always 1 great think after if the char it's bad i don't take the char, if it's good i take the char,( this is my opinion) so if 4-5 person don't like this char ok no problem i respect all the opinion, in all the forum this char was a success so a'm happy for this,and i don't think in the future i found 1 coder can help me for replace the part about the ai and the combo, if i found ok, if i don't found the life goes on,the char it's perfectly playable this is the important think
for the next char( if i try at make 1 other char) if i have the the coder partner ok, but if i don't have the coder partner i use always this method
All right, it's hard for me to decipher this, because your english is astrocious (Yes, I'm aware that you're italian and it's not your primary language)
It's bad because the base you took was horrible to begin with.
Yes, certain other creators have taken other creations and editted them as well(Myself included), but they actually took the time to make proper edits (i.e, not making holy god orochi evil versions of them)
Once again, the don't dl if you don't like it argument is flawed because...well....how else am I going to know if I like something if I don't try it?
This character needs a serious overhaul to even be considered decent. Yes, it need THAT much work. His standing stance doesn't even loop properly, how did you even miss this?
As for the rest of you, I'm aware you guys want to encourage creators with their work, but giving nothing but praise and never pointing out the problems solves nothing and only works on making the problem even worse in the long run.
Post by: JARRO77 on April 14, 2013, 04:06:25 AM
(example 100 persons) and 3-4 people do not like for some reason, ok it's Normal, because One particular thing can not like at all ( Exept for the p****) lol, but if in future i decide to update varnage,going to take into consideration all this stuff you said and try to fix
Post by: Darkflare on April 14, 2013, 04:36:42 AM
So basically, you never intended to bother fixing any of your mistakes and making sure things worked properly. You just released it for the sake of releasing it and who cares how good or bad it is.
Fine, but don't expect people to take you seriously the next time.
Post by: Rage on April 14, 2013, 04:40:53 AM
If hes happy with the way the character plays then that's what he wants. If it not to your liking find something else. once you bring concerns to his attention and he says i hear you but i want it like this move on.
Post by: JARRO77 on April 14, 2013, 04:49:17 AM
for Darkflare man i understand what you say, but i think( NOW I'm seriously considering in your brain there is something wrong I've already explained how I feel, ( THIS IS DIFFERENCES OF OPINION, i like this char and most of people likes it
you don't like this char and it's ok, don't use this char
i think this guy Darkflare has something against me, hum when i listen 1 song, when i play with some char, when i see some movie, or other stuff
( if this Particular think i don't like, a'm not going by the person who made and start at break his c**k for smal stuff, i symply don't use that thing IT'S EASY, i understand what you think, and i told you, if i decide to update in future i try to fix what you say, remember you must always respect the work of the people if you like the work good, if you don't like nothing
Post by: Rage on April 14, 2013, 04:58:19 AM
Thanks Rage for the king words :),you'r rightLOOK IM GETTING TIRED OF THIS NOW! it takes two people to argue. comments like what i bolded above just egg people on. Just dont say anything. If you want to talk it out with him/ her fine do it via pm. Just dont insult each other. If you dont care dont say anything to said person let it be there problem. If things get bad you have us the mediator to mediate the situation.
for Darkflare man i understand what you say, but i think( NOW I'm seriously considering in your brain there is something wrong I've already explained how I feel, ( THIS IS DIFFERENCES OF OPINION, i like this char and most of people likes it
you don't like this char and it's ok, don't use this char
i think this guy Darkflare has something against me, hum when i listen 1 song, when i play with some char, when i see some movie, or other stuff
( if this Particular think i don't like, a'm not going by the person who made and start at break his c**k for smal stuff, i symply don't use that thing IT'S EASY, i understand what you think, and i told you, if i decide to update in future i try to fix what you say, remember you must always respect the work of the people if you like the work good, if you don't like nothing
Now lets chill and get back to gaming and creating. :)
Post by: Darkflare on April 14, 2013, 05:01:06 AM
can we move on. we all know the issues by now. Its a decent start. A decent character period. there are many that don't even make to this stage. I personally don't care for it because of the cosmetics. Thats my opinion. The same as saying Kongs characters are crap. To my knowledge. His characters where made to just bring said characters into mugen. So there is no certain way they should play. People just want to base it off of mvc mechanics because he use those games resources. I know people that consider Kong stuff a god send. I conciser it good because He put allot out there when there wasn't much. Its a starting place. the beginning. Rome wasn't built in a day. If the author never stated said character plays like such they didn't fail/ fall short in creating. It can be viewed as type of copy out but its sound. Things like this gives us a base to better our self in the future. I personally thought my first character was the stuff and nothing was wrong with him but as time went on and i learned more i realized i fell short in doing what I envisioned. So in time i seek to improve my work by just starting over and not fixing the past. Nothing is wrong with that.
If hes happy with the way the character plays then that's what he wants. If it not to your liking find something else. once you bring concerns to his attention and he says i hear you but i want it like this move on.
So you're basically saying that you're willing to accept mediocrity just because you believe it could be a base for something.
This is a decent start? A decent character? My video alone proved how horribly flawed the character is. Even the basics are done wrong in this character.
Kong made those characters just to bring them to Mugen? Maybe it was better off to NOT bring them at all and wait for someone else that was willing to do the job RIGHT to bring them themselves. Seriously, every time I look at a Kong character I always have to ask what the hell he was thinking.
A terrible base will lead to a terrible result. This thing isn't even worth using as a base. It needs to be scrapped and redone again this time looking at properly made characters to use as a base for the work instead of some lopsided "creation" from someone that didn't even care about putting effort.
If you want good results, you gotta put effort into it. Like life, there are no shortcuts in Mugen.
for Darkflare man i understand what you say, but i think( NOW I'm seriously considering in your brain there is something wrong I've already explained how I feel, ( THIS IS DIFFERENCES OF OPINION, i like this char and most of people likes it
you don't like this char and it's ok, don't use this char
I really don't think you understand, but whatever.
i think this guy Darkflare has something against me, hum when i listen 1 song, when i play with some char, when i see some movie, or other stuff
( if this Particular think i don't like, a'm not going by the person who made and start at break his c**k for smal stuff, i symply don't use that thing IT'S EASY, i understand what you think, and i told you, if i decide to update in future i try to fix what you say, remember you must always respect the work of the people if you like the work good, if you don't like nothing
Yea, I have it against you, just like I have it against everyone else I have criticized their work on. :|
You're telling me to respect your work, but it doesn't seem like you respect it yourself enough to even bother to keep working on it.
Looks like I'll be done here. I think I've shown just where this thing is headed to.
Post by: JARRO77 on April 14, 2013, 05:04:28 AM
Post by: Rage on April 14, 2013, 05:16:21 AM
This is mugen. WE CREATE WHAT WE WANT. THERE ARE NO RULES UNTIL YOU APPLY THEM ETHER A SAID GAMES MECHANICS OR YOUR OWN PERSONAL. Your missing the point of what makes this engine so great.
I wont ask yall to chill again.
Post by: C.M.G on April 14, 2013, 05:44:08 AM
Im trying to be cool here please drop it.Ya, got a point their rage. Won't argue with that. ^^(PM)^
This is mugen. WE CREATE WHAT WE WANT. THERE ARE NO RULES UNTIL YOU APPLY THEM ETHER A SAID GAMES MECHANICS OR YOUR OWN PERSONAL. Your missing the point of what makes this engine so great.
I wont ask yall to chill again.
Post by: C.R.O.M. - 有且只有一個 on April 14, 2013, 06:04:21 AM
Post by: Rage on April 14, 2013, 06:11:04 AM
Listen to the Princess she knows what she's talking about, anyways Jarr I love the character however the AI should be toned down a little bit and I only mean a little bit, and some sound on the win pose and possibly the portrait needs fixed other than that I think its great for a first release like Rage said some people do not make it this far.Rage is Rage need i say more [-X
Post by: JARRO77 on April 14, 2013, 06:17:03 AM
Post by: O Ilusionista on April 14, 2013, 08:39:54 AM
Why I hate people that use "It's my first character" as an excuse to cover up their screw ups. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xgbk8r7SaQs#)
Just in preview, you can already see that the blue clsn (the blue boxes) are wrong. We can't just use the "if you don't like, don't download it" phrase because it sounds like an excuse, a excuse that was used a lot here in IMT in the past, but people finally understand that this isn't the way things works.
JARRO77, I want to help you (in fact, Darkflare was trying to help you too), so let me point you somethings, using the video as a guide, ok?
-0:00 - Look at blue boxes in Varnage body. There are too much boxes (this consumes more moemory) and there is a lot of "holes" between those boxes, something that is wrong. The original creator had used an old version of Fighter Factory which has a Automatic CLSN maker, which was intended to be used in projectiles, but people started to use this on the whole chars, so I requested to remove it.
Another exemple in his walk
(http://i.imgur.com/EvozSao.png)
-0:35 - Varnage goes through the enemy, missing it even if he is close to the enemy.
Those moves makes the hitsparks (the flashes when the move hits) appears on the wrong place, plus they doesn't uses the chars hitsparks
(http://i.imgur.com/7wsHS8R.png) (http://i.imgur.com/ZYXi34V.png)
There are more things to fix.
THINGS TO HELP YOU:
Just look at the CLSN of the other char, its just ONE box. That doesn't fits Varnage, but just look how simple it its. There is a great tutorial about boxes here, please read it : http://kod.trinitymugen.net/K.O.D's_Basic_CLSN_Tutorial.html (http://kod.trinitymugen.net/K.O.D's_Basic_CLSN_Tutorial.html)
Here you can see a whole char tutorial in many videos, I know this will helps you a lot too http://www.infinitymugenteam.com/Forum_345/index.php?topic=39096.0 (http://www.infinitymugenteam.com/Forum_345/index.php?topic=39096.0)
I really liked those moves, they are nice ideas
(http://i.imgur.com/eptk8lM.png) (http://i.imgur.com/2MUHXYb.png)
I hope this helps you.
See ya
Post by: C.M.G on April 14, 2013, 08:46:16 AM
Rage, even I do not agree with the way Darkflare say the things sometimes, he is right and have valid points. Those points REALLY needs to be fixed, just take a look at the video:Wow Jarro77 you just got a help from the MUGEN veteran. Please listen to the master as he teaches you the way. ^:)^
Why I hate people that use "It's my first character" as an excuse to cover up their screw ups. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xgbk8r7SaQs#)
Just in preview, you can already see that the blue clsn (the blue boxes) are wrong. We can't just use the "if you don't like, don't download it" phrase because it sounds like an excuse, a excuse that was used a lot here in IMT in the past, but people finally understand that this isn't the way things works.
JARRO77, I want to help you (in fact, Darkflare was trying to help you too), so let me point you somethings, using the video as a guide, ok?
-0:00 - Look at blue boxes in Varnage body. There are too much boxes (this consumes more moemory) and there is a lot of "holes" between those boxes, something that is wrong. The original creator had used an old version of Fighter Factory which has a Automatic CLSN maker, which was intended to be used in projectiles, but people started to use this on the whole chars, so I requested to remove it.
Another exemple in his walk
(http://i.imgur.com/EvozSao.png)
-0:35 - Varnage goes through the enemy, missing it even if he is close to the enemy.
Those moves makes the hitsparks (the flashes when the move hits) appears on the wrong place, plus they doesn't uses the chars hitsparks
(http://i.imgur.com/7wsHS8R.png) (http://i.imgur.com/ZYXi34V.png)
There are more things to fix.
THINGS TO HELP YOU:
Just look at the CLSN of the other char, its just ONE box. That doesn't fits Varnage, but just look how simple it its. There is a great tutorial about boxes here, please read it : http://kod.trinitymugen.net/K.O.D's_Basic_CLSN_Tutorial.html (http://kod.trinitymugen.net/K.O.D's_Basic_CLSN_Tutorial.html)
Here you can see a whole char tutorial in many videos, I know this will helps you a lot too http://www.infinitymugenteam.com/Forum_345/index.php?topic=39096.0 (http://www.infinitymugenteam.com/Forum_345/index.php?topic=39096.0)
I really liked those moves, they are nice ideas
(http://i.imgur.com/eptk8lM.png) (http://i.imgur.com/2MUHXYb.png)
I hope this helps you.
See ya
Post by: Rage on April 14, 2013, 09:50:55 AM
Rage, even I do not agree with the way Darkflare say the things sometimes, he is right and have valid points. Those points REALLY needs to be fixed, just take a look at the video:Lets agree to disagree. I stand by there is no rules in mugen. I seen the video and the character dont meet my standards or yall ether but this aint a business. Nothing NEEDS to be fixed. however it is a decent start. Also he never mentioned a certain play style so...yeah it is what it is. You should have a direction you want to take your work but you can make it just to make it <_<|...| We as a community have certain standards but they are not rules, they are not concrete. So if some operates out side the norm we dont burn him. so if he dont want to be like us let him.
I never said anything about the info Darkflare was giving rather it be good or bad. What is bad is making your points and then keep harping on them when one choose to by pass them. my point is that JARRO77 wasn't interested. if that's the case then there aint nothing to you, me, anyone can do. Now if im to comment on the feed he gave. Minus his tone it was DAME good. I wish someone would do that for me. not to many people go that far.
Sorry if it looked like i was taking Jarro's side. I wasnt, everyone knows i got crazy high standards. I also operate out side the norm too tho.
Post by: JARRO77 on April 14, 2013, 12:14:53 PM
Post by: Macaulyn97 on April 14, 2013, 01:10:04 PM
Post by: JARRO77 on April 14, 2013, 01:20:30 PM
Post by: Macaulyn97 on April 14, 2013, 01:41:08 PM
lolll, i always accept the feedback and the advice i already fix 3 error, said o, but I think there are different ways of saying things,and for what I think Darkflares has used the offensive words can say that just because you are behind a pc, varnage does not have a bad gameplay, at least you tried varnage???.....I did, and when I saw that you used Kong/Arachnoman's Venom as a base, I saw that it was a bad character. I would try at least to change the base, make the character again, this time, use XCB's Venom, you'll see that it will get better comments.
Post by: Darkflare on April 14, 2013, 01:42:37 PM
however the AI should be toned down a little bit and I only mean a little bit,
I don't know if you noticed, but the AI cheats. It breaks out of things it's not supposed to break out of just to throw a super at you. It also completely bypasses the cooldown of his moves for the sake of keeping himself unfairly safe. This is partly due to the way Kong "made" his AIs since you can find the same cheating AI in any of Kong's characters.
and for what I think Darkflares has used the offensive words can say that
When did I use offensive words?
That was you on the comments on my video.
Post by: JARRO77 on April 14, 2013, 01:52:27 PM
for Darkflare i don't like your reasoning, you can't post video in youtube against one char, only because you don't like the char, this is incorrect shame, shame, Shame, so i don't want start other drama, in this forum or in youtube,i think me and you we will never reach a compromise because you have your opinion and i have my opinion so,realy man stop, i don't like solve the problem with the pc, because does not make sense, you were wrong to put that video because you want to see only the bad about the char, and it's incorrect
Post by: Darkflare on April 14, 2013, 02:13:28 PM
Well, a video is worth a thousand pictures, maybe even more.
In other words...
I can.
And I wlll.
Post by: JARRO77 on April 14, 2013, 02:22:15 PM
In other words...
I can.
And I wlll.
and after
I break
Your Face
ok stop now because
ok now seriously we can't solve this situation, you hate me, and i understand this, if someone post some other feedback i thank you and try to fix
Post by: Macaulyn97 on April 14, 2013, 02:44:07 PM
yea man, you can do this stupid and incorrect think only because you is behind a pc,if we do face to face afterI think we're taking the wrong path here. I don't think Darkflare's way to criticize is the right one, but I don't think he hates you. You're taking it too personaly. Remember, MUGEN is supposed to be a game, a form of entertainment, so lets not get to each other's throats, shall we?
In other words...
I can.
And I wlll.
and after
I break
Your Face
ok stop now because
ok now seriously we can't solve this situation, you hate me, and i understand this, if someone post some other feedback i thank you and try to fix
Post by: JARRO77 on April 14, 2013, 03:09:43 PM
I think the important thing is to have fun with the char no despise because you don't like the way about the AI,i don't care the method you use for make the char, if the char it's good it's good, if in the char there is problem try to fix for become better and I'm already doing this
Post by: Darkflare on April 14, 2013, 03:11:41 PM
I think this is the point where we just leave him be to his own sillyness.
Post by: CosmicToxin on April 14, 2013, 06:35:39 PM
@Darkflare and others, not everyone comes to mugen with superior spriteing and coding skills so yeah, i think that the fact that it is his first character is an acceptable excuse. you tried to get your point across to him, and it failed, so stop posting in this thread unless you have something constructive and helpful to say that does not make you sound like a jerk please. [-X
Post by: Darkflare on April 14, 2013, 08:15:52 PM
you should stop playing a white knight, it's about as bad as a jerk.
Post by: C.M.G on April 14, 2013, 08:18:41 PM
yea man, you can do this stupid and incorrect think only because you is behind a pc,if we do face to face afterInternet tough guy. I see.
In other words...
I can.
And I wlll.
and after
I break
Your Face
ok stop now because
ok now seriously we can't solve this situation, you hate me, and i understand this, if someone post some other feedback i thank you and try to fix
Post by: Rage on April 14, 2013, 08:21:58 PM
Post by: Rage on April 16, 2013, 12:57:59 AM
Jarr maybe you could contact team symbioteabout the inclusion of your character in there project. of course you have to modify your character to their gameplay style and tweak much of your coding if you want to join em.
Post by: JARRO77 on April 16, 2013, 01:26:11 AM
because a'm not a coder, and i can't do this
Post by: C.M.G on April 16, 2013, 01:39:38 AM
Thanks Rage for unlocking the post :) ;), for now i only fix the problem about the clns and other small problem, i add the sound in the win pose, but i can't lower the level of the AIJust change this: cmd = Venom_Medium.cmd to cmd = Venom_Easy.cmd in the def. file to lower the AI. The commands are only the problem because tapping 1 button chains to both basic attacks like m.punch to c.punch. A tweeking in the cmd file indeed.
because a'm not a coder, and i can't do this
Post by: JARRO77 on April 16, 2013, 02:14:57 AM
before of this i do the same process but with the venom easy to medium, but the AI was horrible and lose all the match, now it's venom medium to easy
http://www.mediafire.com/?5ag2qvkmiunzg7a (http://www.mediafire.com/?5ag2qvkmiunzg7a)
Post by: catbat74 on April 16, 2013, 02:22:36 AM
http://youtu.be/5GmifTl8lB0 (http://youtu.be/5GmifTl8lB0)
Post by: C.M.G on April 16, 2013, 02:45:15 AM
ok i do this, i take the cmd = Venom_Medium.cmd after copy in desktop, i change the name in easy and i copy and past in cmd = Venom_Easy.cmd in the def i don't know if it's right but try this version and let me knowwhat changes have made to this char?
before of this i do the same process but with the venom easy to medium, but the AI was horrible and lose all the match, now it's venom medium to easy
http://www.mediafire.com/?5ag2qvkmiunzg7a (http://www.mediafire.com/?5ag2qvkmiunzg7a)
Post by: JARRO77 on April 16, 2013, 02:48:05 AM
what changes have made to this char?
I did what you told me to lower the AI
Post by: C.M.G on April 16, 2013, 03:07:53 AM
Post by: JARRO77 on April 16, 2013, 03:13:37 AM
there are so much char with the strongher AI and nobody says anything now for this char instead, the AI its so strong why?? this char can lose ws so much char in whatch mode, and in the arcade you can win,if you think the ai it's hard, lower it with that method
Post by: Rage on April 16, 2013, 04:11:24 AM
Post by: JARRO77 on April 16, 2013, 04:17:28 AM
when make the standing punch or crouch strong punch him don't hit the opponent( lol), in my mugen if i make the standing punch, crouch strong punch i hit perfectly the opponent and i can post a video about this now (if someone does not believe) , and you can see the clsn are ok, if you mean the clsn about O, i already fix the walk, the special attack symbiote drill, and jakchammer, about the Ai, i change the cmd venom medium in easy, and the Ai and still going strong but less than before
Post by: Rage on April 16, 2013, 05:01:01 AM
Post by: Hellzone on April 16, 2013, 05:09:24 AM
if yuo spick about the clns wrong, in the video of Darkflare , darkflare change the clns and put the clns in wrong position, you can see in his video
when make the standing punch or crouch strong punch him don't hit the opponent( lol), in my mugen if i make the standing punch, crouch strong punch i hit perfectly the opponent and i can post a video about this now (if someone does not believe) , and you can see the clsn are ok, if you mean the clsn about O, i already fix the walk, the special attack symbiote drill, and jakchammer, about the Ai, i change the cmd venom medium in easy, and the Ai and still going strong but less than before
Hey man, no one is trying to attack you personally, Everyone is just making suggestions on how to make your character better. I personally like your character but the others who have posted before me are right, there are some changes that are needed, but i'm not one to talk, i'm still new to coding and creating characters. So if you look at what everyone posted in a good when instead of taking it in negative context then it will start an argument, So before this gets too far, ill stop myself. So please don't take this the wrong way. Best to luck of you with your character and future endverous
Post by: C.M.G on April 16, 2013, 05:13:13 AM
man, the base for AI it's by arachnoman, listen me i have the solution for you, take the file easy and copy and past in medium, and after try, the level for the AI decreases , for the my version i take this, because when i play in the game i play in hard mode, i don't like the characters easy to beat, if yuo think the Ai of varnage it's so hard, use this method and you'll decrease the AIThought I'd let you know that Arachnoman uses Kong's Venom as an edit added with a Venom logo background. Yes the AI strong easily we can choose 3 option: easy, medium and hard and it was intentional to put it there. It can be beaten with a lot practice though.
there are so much char with the strongher AI and nobody says anything now for this char instead, the AI its so strong why?? this char can lose ws so much char in whatch mode, and in the arcade you can win,if you think the ai it's hard, lower it with that method
Post by: Yun0 on April 16, 2013, 05:53:31 AM
Rage... I love you...
Post by: C.M.G on April 16, 2013, 06:17:42 AM
>:-(-|:DxDie
Rage... I love you...
Post by: C.R.O.M. - 有且只有一個 on April 16, 2013, 06:38:07 AM
>:-(-|
Rage... I love you...
Do I even want to know why you have the messed up Barakapool in your Avvy?
Post by: JARRO77 on April 16, 2013, 06:52:53 AM
Thought I'd let you know that Arachnoman uses Kong's Venom as an edit added with a Venom logo background. Yes the AI strong easily we can choose 3 option: easy, medium and hard and it was intentional to put it there. It can be beaten with a lot practice though.
yes ok understand, so anyone can choose the Ai and this is 1 great think ;)
in this video you can see i hit the opponent without problem
with the standing punch and crouch strong punch ( and obviously the other attacks too)
this is the same varnage with the same clns
so don't believe in the video of Darkflares
varnage 77 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WP_IPabqm0g#)
Post by: C.M.G on April 16, 2013, 07:20:13 AM
There is also a problem on your chars stance. The blue clsns are many and are separately spaced out. Mr. Illusionista pointed that out days ago in his posted video in this topic. Varnage sometimes can't be hit.
yes ok understand, so anyone can choose the Ai and this is 1 great think ;)
in this video you can see i hit the opponent without problem
with the standing punch and crouch strong punch ( and obviously the other attacks too)
this is the same varnage with the same clns
so don't believe in the video of Darkflares
varnage 77 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WP_IPabqm0g#)
Post by: JARRO77 on April 16, 2013, 08:02:09 AM
Post by: Beto on April 16, 2013, 08:45:09 AM
Post by: O Ilusionista on April 16, 2013, 09:51:00 AM
Quote
in this video you can see i hit the opponent without problem
with the standing punch and crouch strong punch ( and obviously the other attacks too)
this is the same varnage with the same clns
so don't believe in the video of Darkflares
Don't do this. Nobody edited your char to make it wrong. I stated myself that the punch doesn't hits.
If you fix it, ok. But its a big shame to make accusation.
Post by: JARRO77 on April 16, 2013, 12:38:03 PM
If dealing with a char kong, you will need to change some stuff in your codes for your vernage have a game compatible with other chars, maybe someone will help you in the future, make a new AI, I believe that has a lot of variables that need also be removed.
combatible with other char?? why, what happen when you play vs varnage?? if you mean the ai it's so hard to beat, change the Ai: take the file Venom_Easy and copy and past in desktop after change the name in medium Venom_Medium and the problem it's solve
Don't do this. Nobody edited your char to make it wrong. I stated myself that the punch doesn't hits.
If you fix it, ok. But its a big shame to make accusation.
hey man i don't have nothing against you but you don't do this, you can see in the video, i don't change the clns about the standing punch and crouch strong punch, why i can hit the opponent and you no?? it's the same varnage with the same clns
i think some people it's angry because i take the base Ai from a other char, if it's this the problem it makes no sense to continue this,if it's this the problem just say yes it's this the problem, you can't take the Ai from 1 other char, if you want some news listen this: if i make 1 other vip in future, , and i don't have the partner code, i always start vip with this method, i take the base Ai from 1 other char, i don't want become a coder, just to please you i play in the mugen for fun and for make char,( a'm not the first creator who used this method for make a char, and there is so much char very very strongher About the AI and nobody speaks ( i don't need to do name) If 1 char it's strongher about the Ai i don't care, i like the char strongher about the Ai, i don't destroy , damage,stole other char, i just make char, in the correct way with a (coder) in 1 OTHER WAY, take the ai from 1 other char, if you like good, if you don't like nothink
if someone found new clns wrong, tell me for feedback, i try to fix without problem, now i check all the animation and i try at fix the problem about the clns
Post by: O Ilusionista on April 16, 2013, 01:58:10 PM
Quote
I think some people it's angry because i take the base Ai from a other char,
No, that is not the problem. I, for example, do char with very hard AI...
I will be very straight foward: you are not listen to the feedback.
You even said that Darkflare edited your char, that is pure nonsense. Just fix the errors and everything is fine.
But things like threating other people won't work. This will work on the opposite way: people will start to don't like you.
Quote
i don't want become a coder, just to please youThis sounds like a cheap excuse, sorry.
Quote
if you like good, if you don't like nothinkSame here.
Here comes my crap italian:
Adesso pensa: se le persone non erano preoccupati per te, ti richiede di imparare e si evolve come creatore, perché sarebbe dare consigli? Capiche?
We are NOT your enemies, we are trying to help you. But if you keep doing those acts (threating people, make acusations), people will turn against you and start to ignore your works.
Ciao.
Post by: Darkflare on April 16, 2013, 02:11:00 PM
hey man i don't have nothing against you but you don't do this, you can see in the video, i don't change the clns about the standing punch and crouch strong punch, why i can hit the opponent and you no?? it's the same varnage with the same clns
Because my dear silly "friend", the character you're testing it on has "fatter" CLSN.
Oh and because I feel the need to defend myself
Varnageadventure.wmv (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0nNSPPQAn6A#)
On the subjest of the AI, I must tell you(again) that it cheats, because Kong coded his AI to cheat. Seriously, just pay attention to the AI. Here's a fight on the Medium AI.
DF Mugen: All right, for the sake of getting my point across (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9_m--nKwb5g#)
Pay attention to the AI's behaivour and you'll see just how much it cheats. The Hard AI is even worse because adds even more ways to cheat(like giving it hyper armor even if the character normally has no such thing)
Kong was a horrible coder, like seriously bad and unless you do some serious editting and pretty much change all the code, any edits from it will be just as bad.
Ciao.
I once had an italian teacher tell me this actually means hello in italy, not good bye.
Post by: JARRO77 on April 16, 2013, 02:27:02 PM
you're trying to do a bad light about me and the char ( for problem which are easily solved in the next update), the standing punch and crouch strong punch worked, so stop with this stupid video, you its a fake people, with a bad personality,a'm angry now, i don't like the forum only for this reason, because when a group of 3-4 person against ( me) start one stupid war for stupid reason, it makes no sense to continue so now i ask at some moderator for close this post, thanks to all the person for the feedback about the clns put in wrong position
Post by: Rage on April 16, 2013, 02:31:48 PM